Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

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Hav3n
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Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by Hav3n »

Kursk CTF was running. I believe both teams spawn about 90-95% of the time inside of the cabins/houses across from barns with flag in middle.

If you get behind that house and lay C4 and blow it every spawn cycle, taking out several players each time where there is no chance to react or fight back, what do you guys think about that? I've found the uncap main rules on this server to be reasonable, and particularly where its a CTF map and you can attack the main, it all makes sense.

However, to actually camp a spawn point, not just blow C4 once or twice, but to actually camp it as long as you're able and kill everyone over and over and over on spawn, doesn't that seem like an exploit or loophole right now? You may be able to argue that its within the rules, but does it seem like reasonable good form?

I question camping spawn points even with a sniper rifle, but at least you're limited to one shot, and spawn points are fairly fluid on most maps, meaning you won't always spawn right in their sights. I've done it on Al Nas where you camp either side with a sniper rifle and shoot people as they spawn if it makes sense, but rarely does it rise to the level that this C4 in the cabin does.

Laying C4 inside that cabin on Kursk is basically like spawn point camping several spawn points with a 50 cal, simultaneously, for several spawn cycles, with even less skill required. It just strikes me as really bad form. The game and server rules appear to allow it, but should they? We forbid C4 defensive camping on CTF flags, which is a well defined exception on CTF maps. I think we should make a similar exception to forbid C4 camping spawn point(s) more than one or two times. To be instantly killed by C4 on spawn with 4-5 other players, several times in a row seems to not fit the general gameplay culture that the server tries to cultivate with its rules.

Sorry for the long post, but I may as well get it all out. :)
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by zanshin1 »

all of the above...................the reason to make sure you dont get pinned down......your team got you into that situation...I say suck it up and try to get out..........


if anything, you dont change the way you play the game......add another spawn point :31:
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by Hav3n »

Couldn't you say that someone C4 camping a flag on CTF is a team problem? "Well, your team needs to help you clear the area. If you work as a team, you can prevent people laying C4, or at least find the person with the detonator and kill him, or wrench the C4 up. Teamwork guys!"

Yeah, no. They just said it's not allowed. It was outright offensive the sensibilities of fair gameplay given the relevance of the flag and the capacity of a single person to basically shut the game down.

So, I'm following that line of reasoning that there isn't really any other map with the same kind of scenario/circumstance of a single enclosed spawn point where 1 person can kill almost everyone spawning uncontested for several spawn cycles. Note the specificity, this isn't a red push with nades on blue main in Berlin CTF, this is a single player entirely denying all spawning for multiple spawn cycles on Kursk. It strikes me as noteworthy compared to a push being made with nades on Berlin, Al Nas or Lost Village with several players involved.

Seeing it abused on Kursk last night really stood out to me, and so I'm just raising it here.
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by Trench »

Given that the goal in CTF usually /is/ to suppress everything spawning around the flag long enough for your teammates to make it in and away with the flag, I have a hard time calling foul on that one. Sure, C4 is a cheap and cowardly weapon to use as anti-personnel, but that's not unique to CTF or Kursk.

The tendency to spawn within the house on Kursk is the same for both teams to my recollection. Using the death cam to watch when he's having to reload and/or not going in on every spawn wave seems reasonable, as does lamenting to one's self "why didn't we take the sawmill so that we have an alternate spawn."

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fluffy
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by fluffy »

silly c4...who would do such a thing...? :D
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by Hav3n »

How do you square that with not allowing C4 on CTF flags?
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by Trench »

The flag is in one place, and one place only. The spawn points, and opportunities for spawn points, are not. C4'ing the house will definitely give you "the best bang for the buck", but it's not like this definitively "prevents my team from spawning." Putting C4 on a flag rather definitively means the flag taker will be blown up, if you hide your trigger man correctly.

Not that I wrote the Kursk map or the C4 rule to say "this was definitively the intention." Just saying that's how it squares in my head.

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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by Sarge 1/68th Armor »

8-) I'll pass on the obvious Trench. Just too easy. Maybe obe obe these young buck csn figure if out.
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by Hav3n »

Spawning in the barn is so rare, the cabin becomes the "only" spawn point. It does seem to be an exception compared to most maps. For this reason, it seems so similar to not letting people plant C4 on the flag, it allows a single player to dominate and shut the game down for everyone. Almost identical argument and counter argument can be made for both.

It's the first time I'd seen someone abuse it so may be a non-issue. Was the other night though.
Last edited by Hav3n on July 19th, 2015, 10:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by Hav3n »

Sarge 1/68th Armor wrote:8-) I'll pass on the obvious Trench. Just too easy. Maybe obe obe these young buck csn figure if out.
sarge, don't mposs on the opportunitee!! we all want to know what vyou think sincue you're known as such an iedendnpten tnhinker here.

:P
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by zanshin1 »

"It's the first time I'd seen someone abuse it so may be a non-issue"

Its those stoopid kittens......once you let them in, they piss all over.

lol.
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Re: Balancing Rules with Not Being a Horrible Person

Post by Sarge 1/68th Armor »

That Crap was on my phone. Friggin fingers. Lol
Obe Obe.
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