EA 117 Gaming Community

random proposal for feedback. goal is to incentivize increased vigor of gameplay:

1. award 1-3 points for simply stealing, not only capturing the flag on offense

2. award 2-3 points for capturing a spawn point.

sounds simple, but in the Thaler / Sunstein "nudge" behavioral economic school I think it could make a nontrivial positive difference

-jolly

Interesting...is that even possible?

And also...in the "no clear winner vis-a-vis flag caps" scenario...would the points gained via attempted caps and base caps count towards a 'minor victory,' or would it still be, as fluffernutter likes to say, "kills ftw"?

Also, when someone kills the flag carrier, they should get points along with the flag retriever. I don't know how many times I killed the carrier only to be outrun by peeper.

oTTo

I feel you oTTo...I think Spin and Peeper are in competition for who can steal more points and kills.

~ tona

I think some kind of points should be given to the person who kills the flag carrier......i also have had peeps run and return a flag after busting a nut to stop it being taken away lol.....its either that, or no one gets points for returning the flag....only capping the flag....but perhaps they would get points for capturing other spawn points ?! it might encourage people to push forward, than to sit and defend, than stealing someone else's hard work lol...just some ideas.....

I also think more of us should let the flag killer attempt to retrieve his flag. the other thing I kinda hate is when a certain player throws his mines in front of someone else's. If mines are down, don't take away from that person's initiative just because your a points whore. (we should also mention that half the time he dies so his actions are not only unsportsmanlike but futile).

oTTo

Well there are many times I'm very far from the flag carrier I've killed, and I have no intention to break cover or run all the way over there just for three points. Or sometimes I'm even right beside the flag, but am just trying to suppress my score and won't pick it up.

But I do agree about "ownership" of picking up the flag. When I know the "owner" isn't going to break cover and come pick up their flag, so long as the flag is in a safe place I'll just leave it there as being "not mine", too.

The addition I would make to the landmine scenario is to also think of what's best for the team. Indeed, the second person who laid mines may die since they risked heading out into battle. But the first person who laid mines may die too. As a team, I think you want to be "double-mined" so that there are likely to still be mines present even if the base is under pressure and everyone who normally lays them are being camped.

Or else nothing will be there by the time Peeper's Winnebago comes rolling through...

if only the points could be given to the player who stops the carrier, where as anyone else gets nothing for returning it...either way, the flag could be returned, but the one who made the kill gets the reward......either that or reduce the point to 1, regardless...instead of 5?!
sadly, i dont think some will stop with the points whoring......its 'impossible'.............

jolly_giada wrote: ↑May 22nd, 2022, 11:35 pm random proposal for feedback. goal is to incentivize increased vigor of gameplay:

1. award 1-3 points for simply stealing, not only capturing the flag on offense

2. award 2-3 points for capturing a spawn point.

sounds simple, but in the Thaler / Sunstein "nudge" behavioral economic school I think it could make a nontrivial positive difference

-jolly

I remember I brought that up to trench a while back, like maybe a 1 point… hey I grabbed the flag and got an Otto/Cyber RPG in the face consolation prize..?

Too bad we couldn’t set “3 rpgs into the chin = 2 points”

I’m not opposed to the idea. It also gives the guy who may grab the flag and drive it 99% if the way then die… some consolation.

Just meh two cents.. currently in Kentucky, driving to Buffalo tomorrow, then onto New Hampshire!!

BlinkofanEye wrote: ↑May 23rd, 2022, 7:50 am Interesting...is that even possible?

And also...in the "no clear winner vis-a-vis flag caps" scenario...would the points gained via attempted caps and base caps count towards a 'minor victory,' or would it still be, as fluffernutter likes to say, "kills ftw"?

Cant do that in CTF.

What you can do is ADD CTF to CQ.. it’s ugly as hell, and the score shows false cq tickets… but it will end the map when the desired score is reached. 5 for example. Then you can get points for the middle flags as you mentioned.

Weird concept, I did it to add CTF to Monte Cassino in the RTR expansion, because you cannot add CTF into that map, the devs purposely added it in half down so it crashes your server if you even attempt to add it as a game mode.

It does work, but ugly.

I would just stick to “NO” as an answer to the “2 points” for the middle bases, like in Nas, while playing CTF.

Very interesting points...

I'm definitely guilty of maybe stealing some returns. The way I see it is: Get that flag back ASAP!
Especially when outside the comfort zone (halfway across the map). When I know for a fact Peeper is hauling ass ready to obliterate anything in his way. If the flag is 2ft away from the pole then yeah kind of a d*** move. I never really saw it as anything negative, but there is a good point being made. I will try to be thoughtful of this.

I like the idea of rewarding the carrier killer, rather than the returner.

Just circling back.

to clarify:

1. it IS feasible to add N points per flag steal. If so, I vote to do this and to make N=2 and see how it goes.

2. it MAY be feasible to accrue M points per player for spawn point captured. Bang can you clarify this?

ok...just now reading these comments. First hate to hear I'm a "points whore"., I can relax on my play time for sure. Second.. I have NO issues with anyone putting mines in front of mine anywhere as either person is subject to die before anyone run over them and there is safety in numbers. By all means anyone welcome to place theirs in front of mine, behind or beside. The more mines the better. Third, I play to get the flag returned as soon as possible or capped and expect others to do the same even if I die two feet away from the flag. Don't wait on me...get it where it needs to go before the enemy does. Hate to see that some think of me as a point whore or score whore. I just do my best to try and win for my team. But I can certianly change my gameplay.

Why should you have to change your game style BBS ?.....i know when a round of CTF begins, which players are more Gung ho, and go after the flag, and which ones prefer to defend......and even at that point, i get the feeling of which side will end up winning....so dont change your play style to satisfy others.....let THEM step it up, or they can remain quiet.

Its what makes CTF battles so interesting....the different dynamics of each persons game play....but i agree in that not everyone is a team player and will return a flag, even after seeing you bust a nut to stop it from being taken.

I would like to see no points for anyone returning a flag.....just return the flag for your team.....

points point points - I really think it's all just optics and "feels" like someone is robbing someone else of points.

That's why I like either defending or trying to maintain possession of the two control points.
Zero points for that effort for the most part.
And yes, put as many mines as you can...all are welcome because if I've laid them all out and then need to toss another, my previous will disappear.
And this goes hand in hand with the ftk vs nftk
I try to instantly ftk no matter what. Sometimes that works; other times it doesn't.
I just know that on countless occasions when someone doesn't forgive my tk, it will be in a situation where if I could have spawned quicker, I could have stopped a steal.
You will see me chat, "That didn't/doesn't help"
By not ftk, you prevent your teammate from getting back into the game quicker.
...ah, the nuances of the game.

~ tona

ok, then reward someone for capturing a forward spawn point (2 points ).....no reward for returning a flag....

Look, I am not advocating for NOT putting tons of mines down. All I am saying is that the first person who has the wherewithal and ability to place mines in a strategic place should be the one who gets first chance at the kill. If you feel that more mines are needed in a specific spot, place the secondary, backup mines behind the first mines or in a similarly strategic place.

Also, if the returnable flag is not in danger of being recaptured, try and let the 'flag killer' have his chance at it. They stopped the flag from being captured, give them a chance to be rewarded for it. If it wasn't for that person, the flag just might be captured. But, if it is still under attack, then by all means, anyone and everyone should recover it. I personally will say "go get it" if I know that I can't safely (or without disclosing my position) recover the flag.

I guess all I asking for is a little bit more sportsmanship - Don't be a CESAR, be like Jolly or HRD

oTTo

p.s. okay go ahead and let me have it

Don't be a CESAR, be like Jolly or HRD

Impossible >: D

I doubt this is possible, but the alternative would be to give the points from returning the flag, to the player who actually kills the flag carrier..returning the flag would be zero...that way it doesnt matter who returns it....

Back when I was modding DC in the oughties, I tried to dink around with the points scoring method.
Folks always complained about the 'return' whores and getting taken out two feet from the cap point.

The main thing I was going after at the time was to try to reward all who had a hand in capturing the flag.
I may have to revisit that effort now that I'm older and wiser, plus the fact there aren't so many distractions now-a-days.

I'd also like to figure out how to reward the player(s) that takes down the flag carrier.
That could be interesting on a map such as ElAl where two or more players carry it on the way back.
Problem is (IIRC) that the system only registers the cap at the pole and not the 'touches' on the way back.

Now you've got me thinking...

Unless you make a new mod, we CANNOT modify the points system.

I forget what you can do, but I believe there’s 4-5 options.

Flag return points (auto set 3)
Flag attack points (auto set 0)
Flag capture points (auto set 10)

Then the other two are for conquest specific game modes.

So we are really only missing the “attack the flag and you get a few points.”

On my Hello server I added “you get one point for attempting to get the flag” for DCF. Like a little consolation prize lol. Might bump that up to two points, keeps the game more lively and less camping.

Thanks, agree. Think we should do FlagAttackPoints++ or add 2 points. I would advocate for the latter.